GOTTI™'s SAGA | Do you have bearing failure? Tapping? Read!
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Scikotics
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I dont know.. I just know that the fine print that companies establish prior to doing business should really be looked at for now on.
Just so that everyone understands what is going on with Weapon R and I. Here is the email that I have recently got from WR...
Just so that everyone understands what is going on with Weapon R and I. Here is the email that I have recently got from WR...
The case is currently under review, but as it stands right now we are having some issues with the amount of substantial evidence provided in this case. Though it is clear that your engine shows signs of abnormal wear, and the intake pipe did in fact have aluminum flakes in it, it is not shown where the direct connection between the two are. The dealer claims that the aluminum flakes “drawn into cylinders through intake”, but shows no proof of how they came to this conclusion. Were actual flakes found in the cylinders, oil, intake tract, etc? If so, they need to state these findings in a written statement, along with clear photos showing this. A dissection of the oil filter can be a good source of evidence, as if there was indeed aluminum flakes in the oiling system, then the oil filter would have caught at least some of it. This would be a clear indicator of what was going on inside the engine. I was also given a request by management to obtain a hard copy of the estimate, on a dealership letter head.
I’m sorry for the tone of this reply, and please don’t mistake the fact that we are on your side on this one, but we as a manufacturer must be sure that this is in fact a valid claim on our product by the vehicle manufacturer. Warranty denials are a big issue, and should not be accepted without a clear investigation of the facts. We want to be sure that both our company, and you as the consumer, are not being taken for a ride by the vehicle manufacturer. If it comes back as the case that it was in fact the aluminum flakes flowing through the engine that caused its failure, we will provide you with fair compensation for the repairs. I’m including, for your reference, a link to the Specialty Equipment Market Association’s (SEMA) webpage regarding warranty denials based on aftermarket parts, and a link to a clear explanation of the Magnusen-Moss Warranty Act of 1975. We hope to have everything cleared up and resolved in a prompt manner, and thank you for your cooperation and patience.
http://www.enjoythedrive.com/content/?ID=8124
http://www.granatellimotorsports.com/magnusonmoss.htm
I’m sorry for the tone of this reply, and please don’t mistake the fact that we are on your side on this one, but we as a manufacturer must be sure that this is in fact a valid claim on our product by the vehicle manufacturer. Warranty denials are a big issue, and should not be accepted without a clear investigation of the facts. We want to be sure that both our company, and you as the consumer, are not being taken for a ride by the vehicle manufacturer. If it comes back as the case that it was in fact the aluminum flakes flowing through the engine that caused its failure, we will provide you with fair compensation for the repairs. I’m including, for your reference, a link to the Specialty Equipment Market Association’s (SEMA) webpage regarding warranty denials based on aftermarket parts, and a link to a clear explanation of the Magnusen-Moss Warranty Act of 1975. We hope to have everything cleared up and resolved in a prompt manner, and thank you for your cooperation and patience.
http://www.enjoythedrive.com/content/?ID=8124
http://www.granatellimotorsports.com/magnusonmoss.htm
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Joined: Jan 2005
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From: University Place, WA
Just off the top, it sounds like Weapon R is approaching this in an appropriate, professional manner.
Every and any folks involved with something like this NEED results in writing - not just something verbal that can change in the blink of an eye. The Warranty Act even requires determinations to be in writing. I suspect your state attorney general office, consumer protection group would require the dealer and manufacturer to put things in writing. Without things being in writing it is too easy to just say "you misunderstood" or "we didn't say that."
Again, Stu, I fully understand you are in 'damage control mode' now, trying to limit the amount of monitary damage you end up with, but any findings, determinations, agreements, or whatever need to be in writing. (In my state that's an up front absolute requirement for ANY vehicle work above a certain minimum estimated cost.)
I do not know that your dealer is doing anything out of the ordinary or 'shady' but their continued refusal to put anything worthwhile in writing is worrysome.
Weapon R may not be legally liable for any of the damage, but even so they appear willing to step up to the plate and try to help out.
(Why do I say they may not be legally liable? Let's think about this for a moment. If their intake had been shipped lose with other small parts, or even just packed in 'shipping knurdles' or shredded paper, or whatever, would one just mount it without making sure that there was nothing inside it? No. Even a new part, fresh-out-of-the-box may have cardboard dust, instruction sheets, inspector's labels, or factory debris inside. Heck, I won't even put on an oil filter without looking it over first.
Weapon R sounds like they are being very good about this, and if they cover even just some of your out-of-pocket expense, they should gain a whole lot of respect from the community. Their only 'error' may be as little as not including a slip of paper with the header that cautions the user to inspect the product to make sure it is clean before installing...)
Good luck, Stu. I don't think there are any 'winners' in this sort of thing, except maybe for Weapon R getting a bit of deserved word-of-mouth advertising if they help you out.
(Once this is all through, and you've had a chance to calm down and reflect on what you are going through, maybe you should try your hand at writing up a nice article about it, eh?)
Oh! One last thought - this may be at a point where you really need some professional help to guide you through this mess...
Every and any folks involved with something like this NEED results in writing - not just something verbal that can change in the blink of an eye. The Warranty Act even requires determinations to be in writing. I suspect your state attorney general office, consumer protection group would require the dealer and manufacturer to put things in writing. Without things being in writing it is too easy to just say "you misunderstood" or "we didn't say that."
Again, Stu, I fully understand you are in 'damage control mode' now, trying to limit the amount of monitary damage you end up with, but any findings, determinations, agreements, or whatever need to be in writing. (In my state that's an up front absolute requirement for ANY vehicle work above a certain minimum estimated cost.)
I do not know that your dealer is doing anything out of the ordinary or 'shady' but their continued refusal to put anything worthwhile in writing is worrysome.
Weapon R may not be legally liable for any of the damage, but even so they appear willing to step up to the plate and try to help out.
(Why do I say they may not be legally liable? Let's think about this for a moment. If their intake had been shipped lose with other small parts, or even just packed in 'shipping knurdles' or shredded paper, or whatever, would one just mount it without making sure that there was nothing inside it? No. Even a new part, fresh-out-of-the-box may have cardboard dust, instruction sheets, inspector's labels, or factory debris inside. Heck, I won't even put on an oil filter without looking it over first.
Weapon R sounds like they are being very good about this, and if they cover even just some of your out-of-pocket expense, they should gain a whole lot of respect from the community. Their only 'error' may be as little as not including a slip of paper with the header that cautions the user to inspect the product to make sure it is clean before installing...)Good luck, Stu. I don't think there are any 'winners' in this sort of thing, except maybe for Weapon R getting a bit of deserved word-of-mouth advertising if they help you out.
(Once this is all through, and you've had a chance to calm down and reflect on what you are going through, maybe you should try your hand at writing up a nice article about it, eh?)
Oh! One last thought - this may be at a point where you really need some professional help to guide you through this mess...
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All phone conversations that you have had with this matter, it would've been helpful to you if they were recorded.
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Afterthoughts would be more helpful if you thought them first.....
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Afterthoughts would be more helpful if you thought them first.....
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From: University Place, WA
All phone conversations that you have had with this matter, it would've been helpful to you if they were recorded.
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sIcKsCiOnS
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From: SuperiorWash (MD)
Stu, sorry haven't been around to try and help you out on this situation, i was involved with a warranty issue with my buddies 05 honda accord, tryin to help him out...honda was tryin to dick him out of $1,200+ in repairs that they should take care of, but him not knowing how to read anything, was busy gettin it straight.
it sucks now, that you have to scramble and try and settle this with weapon-r, so you won't have to eat all/most of the labor cost.
toyota helpin with the parts cost is nice, and thats wut toyota usually does. they do wut they can to try and keep a customer, not turn them away. not all dealers are money hording dueches!
but in MY OPINION, seein situations like urs, it would have been smart for the dealer to show you the metal flakes,what the cylinder heads look like, oil pan, etc. pictures would also been helpful on their part, to give them a case against you. Seeing is believing, and if no proof in ur eyes is there, i wouldn't take the deal they set u, and tell them to pay for it all, not just the parts.
NOW, ihaven't read the previous 10pages or w.e, so i dunno wut pictures he got, etc.
but if they haven't SHOWED you anything, and just told you. i'd ask to see it, before buying into wut they say.
Stu, let me know if you help understanding something, or other questions.
ill try and help you out my best to benefit you, save you some money bro!
ill be busy tomorrow at 355 toyota and toyota of waldorf, so either send me a PM on here, or call friday.
it sucks now, that you have to scramble and try and settle this with weapon-r, so you won't have to eat all/most of the labor cost.
toyota helpin with the parts cost is nice, and thats wut toyota usually does. they do wut they can to try and keep a customer, not turn them away. not all dealers are money hording dueches!
but in MY OPINION, seein situations like urs, it would have been smart for the dealer to show you the metal flakes,what the cylinder heads look like, oil pan, etc. pictures would also been helpful on their part, to give them a case against you. Seeing is believing, and if no proof in ur eyes is there, i wouldn't take the deal they set u, and tell them to pay for it all, not just the parts.
NOW, ihaven't read the previous 10pages or w.e, so i dunno wut pictures he got, etc.
but if they haven't SHOWED you anything, and just told you. i'd ask to see it, before buying into wut they say.
Stu, let me know if you help understanding something, or other questions.
ill try and help you out my best to benefit you, save you some money bro!
ill be busy tomorrow at 355 toyota and toyota of waldorf, so either send me a PM on here, or call friday.
Thread Starter
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Scikotics
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,720
Well I went by the dealership yesterday and requested that they show me the oil pan and filter.. I actually was suprised to find a few small flakes inside of the oil pan.. I didn't mess with the oil filter.. If I disected it.. obviously metal flakes would be made, so I didn't do that. I am sure that the dealership is going to be putting stuff on letter head now.. I told them that they do have too. So we shall see today. I also ordered the Clutch Masters Stage II clutch since the one I have now is worn. Does anyone know how a claims adjuster works. Maybe if Weapon R sent out a claims adjuster it would be alot easier to see the damage done.
I know right
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From: SuperiorWash (MD)
wow, metal flakes in the oil pan.......do they kno thats normal?? especially at ur mileage, can they say engine flush?? thats wut happens if you don't do it
i dumb service depts.
good luck stu
i dumb service depts.
good luck stu
